Well, like I've said, Marilyn certainly can be a good topic for debate. Here's an e-mail that demonstrates the affect this guy seems to have on people, with my replies under key points. Please feel free to contribute.

I was snooping in you web page and noticed your new comments on Manson.....Intellectual heroes of the past???

I was referring to the point that people we now consider "great" were at their time seen as immoral trouble-makers...........you never know, in 100 years they could be praising his and Nine Inch Nails', etc, lyrics for the fact that they ask you to confront YOUR demons so you can get on with the process of being good people....

I couldn't figure why you would put him in this category.

Did I? I thought the next paragraph goes on to say that I don't really find him exceptional......but a really good conversation piece! You gotta stop reading what you want to read....

So I went visit some Manson sites hoping to get a clue. And I couldn't find one.

Most are run by goons into the dark side or some crap - see that stuff doesn't scare me, it makes me laugh.....I know my personal power and don't feel threatened that easily......but if you want an idea of why I like (NOT idolise) him, read his lyrics......I applaud people who make your average chicken-crap human face parts of life that ARE there, whether we like it or not.....

I mean, what is so impressive to you about a guy who used his brain to scare others sh*tless, as you put it. You've got too much respect for this guy.

I don't......I just think the hype surrounding him is funny.....though I like the music (I'll get into that when I finish my "CyberPunk" page), and the lyrics are good. Remember, I haven't really seen much of him on TV, but if I did, I certainly wouldn't be disgusted by a bit of artistic expression.

Ok maybe he is smart with his business sense, but then it doesn't take a brain in today's society to know that being shocking and offensive will get you noticed.

Yeah, but it doesn't always make you rich

And if you don't have any morals stopping you, then there's lots of money to be made. ( Ok, now you may address me as Miss Moral Majority) hahaha

I didn't know that he had no morals......actually, from his lyrics I thought he did, but had that other aspect that asks you to CONFRONT......I don't know if he's a pig of a person or not, so he could be......and I do know he's said a few negative things to shock, but does that make him immoral?

But really he doesn't shock or offend me personally...I can see that he would to someone who is passionate about their Christian beliefs though...

You have to remember that there are a lot of people on the fringe who respect (maybe even love) Christ, but know that the killers of Christ and many modern day Christians have a lot in common........if he offends "God-fearing Christians" who live corrupt lives but go to church like they meant it, I really couldn't care less.

...but freedom of speech and expression baby!...so I guess they ( I mean Christians) will just have to suck it up, cuz even Manson has his rights, even if he chooses to do that with his rights.

Excuse me, but it seems that Christians have more rights than people like Manson. He's been banned from playing in certain cities, not for anything he did there, but just because of the hype......really, no one can be THAT evil...

Tell me Oz, in your own set of values, don't you think its right to respect others beliefs, even when you don't agree.

As far as I see it, he does....he's just expressing his own beliefs. I can see many people saying he shouldn't have a right to say what he wants......I can't see anywhere that he is trying to take away the right to speak from others.

I guess that's what I really don't like about the guy. And also the brainless little teens who idolize him...

This is due to the emerging sub-culture within sub-cultures which I have dubbed "CyberPunk" - more on that later....

...like my daughter...(though she's not brainless)..just impressed with the rebellion she sees in him I suppose.

Sometimes some of us see much to rebel against......just depends on how awake or how asleep you are to your surroundings...

But that's normal with all teens. I could tolerate her liking him more , if it was more for his musical talent, but he ain't got none...

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.......want to explode my brain, play Celine Dion! Whoa, I mean she has a voice, but does she have to be so excruciatingly melodramatic the whole time? See, that's my opinion, yet millions of others would wonder how I could be failed to be moved by her (well, I am moved, but in the wrong way). You see, Manson and other "CyberPunks" don't fit in......Metal heads would argue he and Nine Inch Nails and the like suck as they ad in too much techno......techno ravers would be put off by the erratic nature of the tracks......this music is truly a sub-culture within sub-cultures.

Ok, so you've got me, hook, line and sinker.

Make that 96% of the time!

 But my response is not so much because of anything Manson says or does, it because I can't figure why you, (and I think you're a really intelligent guy) would even give him a spot on your page.

I encourage debate, and want more people to express their views and maybe accept new ones......mental man must continue to evolve....and I do like the music and lyrics.

I guess I expect you to see it my way, when I can't even see it your way.

I can see your way......maybe so much so that there is actually a small part of me that is scared by him and what he (supposedly) represents......but it is, after all, just a part of me.....people who identify themselves with one set of beliefs leave themselves open to their own inflexibility.

But still that's my opinion ( and opinions are like assholes, everybody's got one). Well he is definitely the person to put on your page if you want a response... and hate mail, hehehehe

Like I said, he's a good conversation piece!

I really had fun checking out those Manson hater sites!! "Manson Ate My Balls" !! hahaha

I'll have to actually do that - I've only come across a bit of that, but geez they were boring.....they never really said much, or really seemed to know why they didn't like him, or what actually made him immoral......some said he looked like a transvestite.......yeah, so what? Is that gonna change the planet or something? And what if he turned out to actually be a homosexual - would you stop hounding him coz it's not politically correct to hassle gays anymore? Though that's a silly question because in some peoples' minds it would make him look even worse.

(This debate occurred late in 1997; it is interesting to note that this person now thoroughly enjoys Marilyn Manson's music, his lyrics, and even his costumes/makeup and antics. Times change...)